{"@context":"http://iiif.io/api/presentation/3/context.json","id":"https://aviary.ecds.emory.edu/iiif/x921c1v69g/manifest","type":"Manifest","label":{"en":["An interview with Mona Siddiqui: The Limits of Law and Pluralism"]},"logo":"https://d9jk7wjtjpu5g.cloudfront.net/organizations/logo_images/000/000/040/original/eu-logo-shield.png?1608761524","metadata":[{"label":{"en":["Description"]},"value":{"en":["\u003cp\u003eIn this March 27, 2019 interview at Emory University's Center for the Study of Law and Religion, Dr. Mona Siddiqui reflects on her Berman Lecture, entitled, \"Doing God in Europe: The Limits of Law and Pluralism.\"\u003c/p\u003e\r\n\u003cp\u003e \u003c/p\u003e\r\n\u003cp\u003eMona Siddiqui joined the University of Edinburgh’s Divinity school in December 2011 as the first person to hold a chair in Islamic and Interreligious Studies. She also holds the posts of Assistant Principal for Religion and Society and Dean international for the Middle East at the University of Edinburgh. Prior to this she worked at Glasgow University directing the Centre for the Study of Islam. Her research areas are primarily in the field of Islamic jurisprudence (fiqh) and ethics and Christian-Muslim relations.\u003c/p\u003e\r\n\u003cp\u003e \u003c/p\u003e\r\n\u003cp\u003e\u003ca href=\"https://www.ed.ac.uk/profile/mona-siddiqui\"\u003ehttps://www.ed.ac.uk/profile/mona-siddiqui\u003c/a\u003e\u003c/p\u003e"]}}],"summary":{"en":["\u003cp\u003eIn this March 27, 2019 interview at Emory University's Center for the Study of Law and Religion, Dr. Mona Siddiqui reflects on her Berman Lecture, entitled, \"Doing God in Europe: The Limits of Law and Pluralism.\"\u003c/p\u003e\r\n\u003cp\u003e\u0026nbsp;\u003c/p\u003e\r\n\u003cp\u003eMona Siddiqui joined the University of Edinburgh\u0026rsquo;s Divinity school in December 2011 as the first person to hold a chair in Islamic and Interreligious Studies. She also holds the posts of Assistant Principal for Religion and Society and Dean international for the Middle East at the University of Edinburgh. Prior to this she worked at Glasgow University directing the Centre for the Study of Islam. Her research areas are primarily in the field of Islamic jurisprudence (fiqh) and ethics and Christian-Muslim relations.\u003c/p\u003e\r\n\u003cp\u003e\u0026nbsp;\u003c/p\u003e\r\n\u003cp\u003e\u003ca href=\"https://www.ed.ac.uk/profile/mona-siddiqui\"\u003ehttps://www.ed.ac.uk/profile/mona-siddiqui\u003c/a\u003e\u003c/p\u003e"]},"provider":[{"id":"https://aviary.ecds.emory.edu/aboutus","type":"Agent","label":{"en":["Emory University"]},"homepage":[{"id":"https://aviary.ecds.emory.edu/","type":"Text","label":{"en":["Emory University"]},"format":"text/html"}],"logo":[{"id":"https://d9jk7wjtjpu5g.cloudfront.net/organizations/logo_images/000/000/040/original/eu-logo-shield.png?1608761524","type":"Image"}]}],"thumbnail":[{"id":"https://d9jk7wjtjpu5g.cloudfront.net/collection_resource_files/thumbnails/000/101/167/small/open-uri20201115-1609-s1wu9c?1605480346","type":"Image","format":"image/jpeg"}],"items":[{"id":"https://aviary.ecds.emory.edu/collections/1098/collection_resources/32404/file/101167","type":"Canvas","label":{"en":["Media File 1 of 1 - Mona Siddiqui interview: The Limits of Law and Pluralism"]},"duration":863.0,"width":640,"height":360,"thumbnail":[{"id":"https://d9jk7wjtjpu5g.cloudfront.net/collection_resource_files/thumbnails/000/101/167/small/open-uri20201115-1609-s1wu9c?1605480346","type":"Image","format":"image/jpeg"}],"items":[{"id":"https://aviary.ecds.emory.edu/collections/1098/collection_resources/32404/file/101167/content/1","type":"AnnotationPage","items":[{"id":"https://aviary.ecds.emory.edu/collections/1098/collection_resources/32404/file/101167/content/1/annotation/1","type":"Annotation","motivation":"painting","body":{"id":"https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=qilHQYD5QNk","type":"Video","format":"video/youtube","duration":863.0,"width":640,"height":360},"target":"https://aviary.ecds.emory.edu/collections/1098/collection_resources/32404/file/101167","metadata":[]}]}],"annotations":[{"id":"https://aviary.ecds.emory.edu/collections/1098/collection_resources/32404/file/101167/transcript/20890","type":"AnnotationPage","label":{"en":["YouTube English [Transcript]"]},"items":[{"id":"https://aviary.ecds.emory.edu/collections/1098/collection_resources/32404/file/101167/transcript/20890/annotation/1","type":"Annotation","motivation":"transcribing","body":{"type":"TextualBody","value":"My name is Mona Siddiqui and I\u0026#39;m a professor of Islamic and inter-religious studies at","format":"text/plain"},"target":"https://aviary.ecds.emory.edu/collections/1098/collection_resources/32404/file/101167#t=5.77,10.12"},{"id":"https://aviary.ecds.emory.edu/collections/1098/collection_resources/32404/file/101167/transcript/20890/annotation/2","type":"Annotation","motivation":"transcribing","body":{"type":"TextualBody","value":"the school of divinity where I\u0026#39;ve \nworked for just over seven years.  ","format":"text/plain"},"target":"https://aviary.ecds.emory.edu/collections/1098/collection_resources/32404/file/101167#t=10.12,12.91"},{"id":"https://aviary.ecds.emory.edu/collections/1098/collection_resources/32404/file/101167/transcript/20890/annotation/3","type":"Annotation","motivation":"transcribing","body":{"type":"TextualBody","value":"And I\u0026#39;m in the, I teach Islamic law and \nethics and Christian-Muslim relations.","format":"text/plain"},"target":"https://aviary.ecds.emory.edu/collections/1098/collection_resources/32404/file/101167#t=12.91,23.22"},{"id":"https://aviary.ecds.emory.edu/collections/1098/collection_resources/32404/file/101167/transcript/20890/annotation/4","type":"Annotation","motivation":"transcribing","body":{"type":"TextualBody","value":"In 2016 I was invited to give the Gifford Lectures at the University of Aberdeen on the theme of  ","format":"text/plain"},"target":"https://aviary.ecds.emory.edu/collections/1098/collection_resources/32404/file/101167#t=23.22,28.74"},{"id":"https://aviary.ecds.emory.edu/collections/1098/collection_resources/32404/file/101167/transcript/20890/annotation/5","type":"Annotation","motivation":"transcribing","body":{"type":"TextualBody","value":"human struggle. So I\u0026#39;m looking at both Christian and Muslim perspectives through the prism of  ","format":"text/plain"},"target":"https://aviary.ecds.emory.edu/collections/1098/collection_resources/32404/file/101167#t=28.74,34.44"},{"id":"https://aviary.ecds.emory.edu/collections/1098/collection_resources/32404/file/101167/transcript/20890/annotation/6","type":"Annotation","motivation":"transcribing","body":{"type":"TextualBody","value":"certain writers and how they dealt with their own struggle in their lifetime. And that book  ","format":"text/plain"},"target":"https://aviary.ecds.emory.edu/collections/1098/collection_resources/32404/file/101167#t=34.44,39.9"},{"id":"https://aviary.ecds.emory.edu/collections/1098/collection_resources/32404/file/101167/transcript/20890/annotation/7","type":"Annotation","motivation":"transcribing","body":{"type":"TextualBody","value":"should have been submitted by the end of January, but it will be done by the end of this year.","format":"text/plain"},"target":"https://aviary.ecds.emory.edu/collections/1098/collection_resources/32404/file/101167#t=39.9,49.15"},{"id":"https://aviary.ecds.emory.edu/collections/1098/collection_resources/32404/file/101167/transcript/20890/annotation/8","type":"Annotation","motivation":"transcribing","body":{"type":"TextualBody","value":"It\u0026#39;s completely a vanity project. These are people that appeal to me and I was trying  ","format":"text/plain"},"target":"https://aviary.ecds.emory.edu/collections/1098/collection_resources/32404/file/101167#t=49.15,54.3"},{"id":"https://aviary.ecds.emory.edu/collections/1098/collection_resources/32404/file/101167/transcript/20890/annotation/9","type":"Annotation","motivation":"transcribing","body":{"type":"TextualBody","value":"to find a link between, a thematic link between them, so that\u0026#39;s how I chose them. I mean there\u0026#39;s  ","format":"text/plain"},"target":"https://aviary.ecds.emory.edu/collections/1098/collection_resources/32404/file/101167#t=54.3,60.69"},{"id":"https://aviary.ecds.emory.edu/collections/1098/collection_resources/32404/file/101167/transcript/20890/annotation/10","type":"Annotation","motivation":"transcribing","body":{"type":"TextualBody","value":"no logic to it really, other than my own logic, but these are richly contested figureheads of  ","format":"text/plain"},"target":"https://aviary.ecds.emory.edu/collections/1098/collection_resources/32404/file/101167#t=60.69,67.95"},{"id":"https://aviary.ecds.emory.edu/collections/1098/collection_resources/32404/file/101167/transcript/20890/annotation/11","type":"Annotation","motivation":"transcribing","body":{"type":"TextualBody","value":"both traditions in many ways. Apart from one pairing which is the 11th century theologian  ","format":"text/plain"},"target":"https://aviary.ecds.emory.edu/collections/1098/collection_resources/32404/file/101167#t=67.95,74.28"},{"id":"https://aviary.ecds.emory.edu/collections/1098/collection_resources/32404/file/101167/transcript/20890/annotation/12","type":"Annotation","motivation":"transcribing","body":{"type":"TextualBody","value":"Ghazali, and the Austrian poet Rainer Rilke who both wrote letters to a disciple and I\u0026#39;m  ","format":"text/plain"},"target":"https://aviary.ecds.emory.edu/collections/1098/collection_resources/32404/file/101167#t=74.28,81.18"},{"id":"https://aviary.ecds.emory.edu/collections/1098/collection_resources/32404/file/101167/transcript/20890/annotation/13","type":"Annotation","motivation":"transcribing","body":{"type":"TextualBody","value":"trying to compare what do they write in those letters that could have some similar content.","format":"text/plain"},"target":"https://aviary.ecds.emory.edu/collections/1098/collection_resources/32404/file/101167#t=81.18,90.8"},{"id":"https://aviary.ecds.emory.edu/collections/1098/collection_resources/32404/file/101167/transcript/20890/annotation/14","type":"Annotation","motivation":"transcribing","body":{"type":"TextualBody","value":"Pluralism for me is really the lived reality of our lives at the moment in the West. So I\u0026#39;m not  ","format":"text/plain"},"target":"https://aviary.ecds.emory.edu/collections/1098/collection_resources/32404/file/101167#t=90.8,96.47"},{"id":"https://aviary.ecds.emory.edu/collections/1098/collection_resources/32404/file/101167/transcript/20890/annotation/15","type":"Annotation","motivation":"transcribing","body":{"type":"TextualBody","value":"looking at pluralism necessarily constitutionally, even legally, but what is the social space in which  ","format":"text/plain"},"target":"https://aviary.ecds.emory.edu/collections/1098/collection_resources/32404/file/101167#t=96.47,104.3"},{"id":"https://aviary.ecds.emory.edu/collections/1098/collection_resources/32404/file/101167/transcript/20890/annotation/16","type":"Annotation","motivation":"transcribing","body":{"type":"TextualBody","value":"pluralism is both lived and contested? \nSo how do different communities come to the public  ","format":"text/plain"},"target":"https://aviary.ecds.emory.edu/collections/1098/collection_resources/32404/file/101167#t=104.3,111.44"},{"id":"https://aviary.ecds.emory.edu/collections/1098/collection_resources/32404/file/101167/transcript/20890/annotation/17","type":"Annotation","motivation":"transcribing","body":{"type":"TextualBody","value":"light or public attention? And for me, it\u0026#39;s personally, my own personal take on this is  ","format":"text/plain"},"target":"https://aviary.ecds.emory.edu/collections/1098/collection_resources/32404/file/101167#t=111.44,118.55"},{"id":"https://aviary.ecds.emory.edu/collections/1098/collection_resources/32404/file/101167/transcript/20890/annotation/18","type":"Annotation","motivation":"transcribing","body":{"type":"TextualBody","value":"that it\u0026#39;s usually through legal cases. \nSo we can of course talk about plural societies  ","format":"text/plain"},"target":"https://aviary.ecds.emory.edu/collections/1098/collection_resources/32404/file/101167#t=118.55,122.99"},{"id":"https://aviary.ecds.emory.edu/collections/1098/collection_resources/32404/file/101167/transcript/20890/annotation/19","type":"Annotation","motivation":"transcribing","body":{"type":"TextualBody","value":"as societies of communities living next door to each other, but actually it\u0026#39;s only when there  ","format":"text/plain"},"target":"https://aviary.ecds.emory.edu/collections/1098/collection_resources/32404/file/101167#t=122.99,128.84"},{"id":"https://aviary.ecds.emory.edu/collections/1098/collection_resources/32404/file/101167/transcript/20890/annotation/20","type":"Annotation","motivation":"transcribing","body":{"type":"TextualBody","value":"are issues that make a public debate - which are usually legal cases or cases which ","format":"text/plain"},"target":"https://aviary.ecds.emory.edu/collections/1098/collection_resources/32404/file/101167#t=128.84,134.51"},{"id":"https://aviary.ecds.emory.edu/collections/1098/collection_resources/32404/file/101167/transcript/20890/annotation/21","type":"Annotation","motivation":"transcribing","body":{"type":"TextualBody","value":"seem to be legally controversial that we start debating; well, what is pluralism? And what are  ","format":"text/plain"},"target":"https://aviary.ecds.emory.edu/collections/1098/collection_resources/32404/file/101167#t=134.51,142.91"},{"id":"https://aviary.ecds.emory.edu/collections/1098/collection_resources/32404/file/101167/transcript/20890/annotation/22","type":"Annotation","motivation":"transcribing","body":{"type":"TextualBody","value":"the challenges of pluralism? As a Muslim academic who is, who lives in the West but  ","format":"text/plain"},"target":"https://aviary.ecds.emory.edu/collections/1098/collection_resources/32404/file/101167#t=142.91,149.45"},{"id":"https://aviary.ecds.emory.edu/collections/1098/collection_resources/32404/file/101167/transcript/20890/annotation/23","type":"Annotation","motivation":"transcribing","body":{"type":"TextualBody","value":"has lived all her life in the West and enjoyed all the liberties of the West, for me this is  ","format":"text/plain"},"target":"https://aviary.ecds.emory.edu/collections/1098/collection_resources/32404/file/101167#t=149.45,154.07"},{"id":"https://aviary.ecds.emory.edu/collections/1098/collection_resources/32404/file/101167/transcript/20890/annotation/24","type":"Annotation","motivation":"transcribing","body":{"type":"TextualBody","value":"a real challenge, how do you raise the bar of that conversation so the people are engaged in  ","format":"text/plain"},"target":"https://aviary.ecds.emory.edu/collections/1098/collection_resources/32404/file/101167#t=154.07,158.87"},{"id":"https://aviary.ecds.emory.edu/collections/1098/collection_resources/32404/file/101167/transcript/20890/annotation/25","type":"Annotation","motivation":"transcribing","body":{"type":"TextualBody","value":"the conversation around pluralism and not just trying to defend a particular stance?","format":"text/plain"},"target":"https://aviary.ecds.emory.edu/collections/1098/collection_resources/32404/file/101167#t=158.87,167.43"},{"id":"https://aviary.ecds.emory.edu/collections/1098/collection_resources/32404/file/101167/transcript/20890/annotation/26","type":"Annotation","motivation":"transcribing","body":{"type":"TextualBody","value":"There was a very recent case on Asher\u0026#39;s Bakery where a Christian couple refused  ","format":"text/plain"},"target":"https://aviary.ecds.emory.edu/collections/1098/collection_resources/32404/file/101167#t=167.43,174.45"},{"id":"https://aviary.ecds.emory.edu/collections/1098/collection_resources/32404/file/101167/transcript/20890/annotation/27","type":"Annotation","motivation":"transcribing","body":{"type":"TextualBody","value":"to put a logo, a particular logo endorsing gay marriage or same-sex marriage on a cake.  ","format":"text/plain"},"target":"https://aviary.ecds.emory.edu/collections/1098/collection_resources/32404/file/101167#t=174.45,181.38"},{"id":"https://aviary.ecds.emory.edu/collections/1098/collection_resources/32404/file/101167/transcript/20890/annotation/28","type":"Annotation","motivation":"transcribing","body":{"type":"TextualBody","value":"And the couple won the case on the basis that they weren\u0026#39;t discriminating against the person,  ","format":"text/plain"},"target":"https://aviary.ecds.emory.edu/collections/1098/collection_resources/32404/file/101167#t=181.38,188.31"},{"id":"https://aviary.ecds.emory.edu/collections/1098/collection_resources/32404/file/101167/transcript/20890/annotation/29","type":"Annotation","motivation":"transcribing","body":{"type":"TextualBody","value":"but their freedom of conscience would not allow them to put a particular message on. This case  ","format":"text/plain"},"target":"https://aviary.ecds.emory.edu/collections/1098/collection_resources/32404/file/101167#t=188.31,194.28"},{"id":"https://aviary.ecds.emory.edu/collections/1098/collection_resources/32404/file/101167/transcript/20890/annotation/30","type":"Annotation","motivation":"transcribing","body":{"type":"TextualBody","value":"became controversial because the person who wanted that cake with that particular logo  ","format":"text/plain"},"target":"https://aviary.ecds.emory.edu/collections/1098/collection_resources/32404/file/101167#t=194.28,199.47"},{"id":"https://aviary.ecds.emory.edu/collections/1098/collection_resources/32404/file/101167/transcript/20890/annotation/31","type":"Annotation","motivation":"transcribing","body":{"type":"TextualBody","value":"felt that he was discriminated against and that as a public service, as a bakers on the  ","format":"text/plain"},"target":"https://aviary.ecds.emory.edu/collections/1098/collection_resources/32404/file/101167#t=199.47,204.6"},{"id":"https://aviary.ecds.emory.edu/collections/1098/collection_resources/32404/file/101167/transcript/20890/annotation/32","type":"Annotation","motivation":"transcribing","body":{"type":"TextualBody","value":"high street, they should treat all customers equally. That\u0026#39;s only one area of contention,  ","format":"text/plain"},"target":"https://aviary.ecds.emory.edu/collections/1098/collection_resources/32404/file/101167#t=204.6,211.62"},{"id":"https://aviary.ecds.emory.edu/collections/1098/collection_resources/32404/file/101167/transcript/20890/annotation/33","type":"Annotation","motivation":"transcribing","body":{"type":"TextualBody","value":"but I think it would be fair to say that for most areas of pluralist contention, it\u0026#39;s between  ","format":"text/plain"},"target":"https://aviary.ecds.emory.edu/collections/1098/collection_resources/32404/file/101167#t=211.62,217.8"},{"id":"https://aviary.ecds.emory.edu/collections/1098/collection_resources/32404/file/101167/transcript/20890/annotation/34","type":"Annotation","motivation":"transcribing","body":{"type":"TextualBody","value":"different faith communities or different racial communities, that\u0026#39;s why there were challenges.","format":"text/plain"},"target":"https://aviary.ecds.emory.edu/collections/1098/collection_resources/32404/file/101167#t=217.8,225.15"},{"id":"https://aviary.ecds.emory.edu/collections/1098/collection_resources/32404/file/101167/transcript/20890/annotation/35","type":"Annotation","motivation":"transcribing","body":{"type":"TextualBody","value":"So when I say secular I mean in the sense that not anti-religion, but in the way Charles Taylor  ","format":"text/plain"},"target":"https://aviary.ecds.emory.edu/collections/1098/collection_resources/32404/file/101167#t=225.15,231.24"},{"id":"https://aviary.ecds.emory.edu/collections/1098/collection_resources/32404/file/101167/transcript/20890/annotation/36","type":"Annotation","motivation":"transcribing","body":{"type":"TextualBody","value":"uses that the religion has lost its public hold. Religious discourse is not part of our  ","format":"text/plain"},"target":"https://aviary.ecds.emory.edu/collections/1098/collection_resources/32404/file/101167#t=231.24,236.07"},{"id":"https://aviary.ecds.emory.edu/collections/1098/collection_resources/32404/file/101167/transcript/20890/annotation/37","type":"Annotation","motivation":"transcribing","body":{"type":"TextualBody","value":"institutions, religious worship is not part of our institutions, we don\u0026#39;t open things with  ","format":"text/plain"},"target":"https://aviary.ecds.emory.edu/collections/1098/collection_resources/32404/file/101167#t=236.07,241.17"},{"id":"https://aviary.ecds.emory.edu/collections/1098/collection_resources/32404/file/101167/transcript/20890/annotation/38","type":"Annotation","motivation":"transcribing","body":{"type":"TextualBody","value":"prayers anymore, most of us. Increasingly there are less, fewer and fewer religious exemptions  ","format":"text/plain"},"target":"https://aviary.ecds.emory.edu/collections/1098/collection_resources/32404/file/101167#t=241.17,246.81"},{"id":"https://aviary.ecds.emory.edu/collections/1098/collection_resources/32404/file/101167/transcript/20890/annotation/39","type":"Annotation","motivation":"transcribing","body":{"type":"TextualBody","value":"to be made in, in civic life. So in that sense, for me, secularity as a process has been about, at it\u0026#39;s  ","format":"text/plain"},"target":"https://aviary.ecds.emory.edu/collections/1098/collection_resources/32404/file/101167#t=246.81,255.15"},{"id":"https://aviary.ecds.emory.edu/collections/1098/collection_resources/32404/file/101167/transcript/20890/annotation/40","type":"Annotation","motivation":"transcribing","body":{"type":"TextualBody","value":"very best about equality under the law and I suppose some would critique it for saying that  ","format":"text/plain"},"target":"https://aviary.ecds.emory.edu/collections/1098/collection_resources/32404/file/101167#t=255.15,261.03"},{"id":"https://aviary.ecds.emory.edu/collections/1098/collection_resources/32404/file/101167/transcript/20890/annotation/41","type":"Annotation","motivation":"transcribing","body":{"type":"TextualBody","value":"it\u0026#39;s about trying to flatten society so that \nwe all have to conform to the same principles  ","format":"text/plain"},"target":"https://aviary.ecds.emory.edu/collections/1098/collection_resources/32404/file/101167#t=261.03,266.34"},{"id":"https://aviary.ecds.emory.edu/collections/1098/collection_resources/32404/file/101167/transcript/20890/annotation/42","type":"Annotation","motivation":"transcribing","body":{"type":"TextualBody","value":"all the time. I think that what has taken place, in its place, is the issue of values that where  ","format":"text/plain"},"target":"https://aviary.ecds.emory.edu/collections/1098/collection_resources/32404/file/101167#t=266.34,273.96"},{"id":"https://aviary.ecds.emory.edu/collections/1098/collection_resources/32404/file/101167/transcript/20890/annotation/43","type":"Annotation","motivation":"transcribing","body":{"type":"TextualBody","value":"you have nation states where there, where the state has huge control over what\u0026#39;s public and  ","format":"text/plain"},"target":"https://aviary.ecds.emory.edu/collections/1098/collection_resources/32404/file/101167#t=273.96,278.25"},{"id":"https://aviary.ecds.emory.edu/collections/1098/collection_resources/32404/file/101167/transcript/20890/annotation/44","type":"Annotation","motivation":"transcribing","body":{"type":"TextualBody","value":"what\u0026#39;s private, even though it says it doesn\u0026#39;t. What it\u0026#39;s really arguing is that do we all sign  ","format":"text/plain"},"target":"https://aviary.ecds.emory.edu/collections/1098/collection_resources/32404/file/101167#t=278.25,284.43"},{"id":"https://aviary.ecds.emory.edu/collections/1098/collection_resources/32404/file/101167/transcript/20890/annotation/45","type":"Annotation","motivation":"transcribing","body":{"type":"TextualBody","value":"up to the same values in our relationships in societies, and that\u0026#39;s what makes a  ","format":"text/plain"},"target":"https://aviary.ecds.emory.edu/collections/1098/collection_resources/32404/file/101167#t=284.43,289.68"},{"id":"https://aviary.ecds.emory.edu/collections/1098/collection_resources/32404/file/101167/transcript/20890/annotation/46","type":"Annotation","motivation":"transcribing","body":{"type":"TextualBody","value":"civic space. So the question of values has now, I think, become a really dominant discourse and  ","format":"text/plain"},"target":"https://aviary.ecds.emory.edu/collections/1098/collection_resources/32404/file/101167#t=289.68,295.47"},{"id":"https://aviary.ecds.emory.edu/collections/1098/collection_resources/32404/file/101167/transcript/20890/annotation/47","type":"Annotation","motivation":"transcribing","body":{"type":"TextualBody","value":"when it comes to minority communities, again no one is particularly interested in  ","format":"text/plain"},"target":"https://aviary.ecds.emory.edu/collections/1098/collection_resources/32404/file/101167#t=295.47,299.79"},{"id":"https://aviary.ecds.emory.edu/collections/1098/collection_resources/32404/file/101167/transcript/20890/annotation/48","type":"Annotation","motivation":"transcribing","body":{"type":"TextualBody","value":"their doctrines and worship, they\u0026#39;re interested in what values are you bringing to public space.","format":"text/plain"},"target":"https://aviary.ecds.emory.edu/collections/1098/collection_resources/32404/file/101167#t=299.79,307.57"},{"id":"https://aviary.ecds.emory.edu/collections/1098/collection_resources/32404/file/101167/transcript/20890/annotation/49","type":"Annotation","motivation":"transcribing","body":{"type":"TextualBody","value":"I think liberalism does, at least until quite recently what we\u0026#39;re seeing even in Western  ","format":"text/plain"},"target":"https://aviary.ecds.emory.edu/collections/1098/collection_resources/32404/file/101167#t=307.57,313.99"},{"id":"https://aviary.ecds.emory.edu/collections/1098/collection_resources/32404/file/101167/transcript/20890/annotation/50","type":"Annotation","motivation":"transcribing","body":{"type":"TextualBody","value":"Europe. You know personally speaking, I can\u0026#39;t divorce myself from my upbringing and the way  ","format":"text/plain"},"target":"https://aviary.ecds.emory.edu/collections/1098/collection_resources/32404/file/101167#t=313.99,319.39"},{"id":"https://aviary.ecds.emory.edu/collections/1098/collection_resources/32404/file/101167/transcript/20890/annotation/51","type":"Annotation","motivation":"transcribing","body":{"type":"TextualBody","value":"I live my life, so I would say if I go to Europe, I know that anywhere in Europe I can go, I know  ","format":"text/plain"},"target":"https://aviary.ecds.emory.edu/collections/1098/collection_resources/32404/file/101167#t=319.39,324.76"},{"id":"https://aviary.ecds.emory.edu/collections/1098/collection_resources/32404/file/101167/transcript/20890/annotation/52","type":"Annotation","motivation":"transcribing","body":{"type":"TextualBody","value":"it\u0026#39;s similar values, similar lifestyles, similar expectations of how I am to be in civic life.","format":"text/plain"},"target":"https://aviary.ecds.emory.edu/collections/1098/collection_resources/32404/file/101167#t=324.76,331.42"},{"id":"https://aviary.ecds.emory.edu/collections/1098/collection_resources/32404/file/101167/transcript/20890/annotation/53","type":"Annotation","motivation":"transcribing","body":{"type":"TextualBody","value":"If I go to a Muslim country, it shifts slightly. I\u0026#39;m not saying one is worse or better, but there are  ","format":"text/plain"},"target":"https://aviary.ecds.emory.edu/collections/1098/collection_resources/32404/file/101167#t=331.42,336.25"},{"id":"https://aviary.ecds.emory.edu/collections/1098/collection_resources/32404/file/101167/transcript/20890/annotation/54","type":"Annotation","motivation":"transcribing","body":{"type":"TextualBody","value":"different freedoms that we take for granted in the West. And I think it\u0026#39;s really dangerous to  ","format":"text/plain"},"target":"https://aviary.ecds.emory.edu/collections/1098/collection_resources/32404/file/101167#t=336.25,340.27"},{"id":"https://aviary.ecds.emory.edu/collections/1098/collection_resources/32404/file/101167/transcript/20890/annotation/55","type":"Annotation","motivation":"transcribing","body":{"type":"TextualBody","value":"undermine those freedoms, that somehow liberalism is trying to take away the freedoms or religious  ","format":"text/plain"},"target":"https://aviary.ecds.emory.edu/collections/1098/collection_resources/32404/file/101167#t=340.27,345.22"},{"id":"https://aviary.ecds.emory.edu/collections/1098/collection_resources/32404/file/101167/transcript/20890/annotation/56","type":"Annotation","motivation":"transcribing","body":{"type":"TextualBody","value":"people. It\u0026#39;s actually, I don\u0026#39;t necessarily think that\u0026#39;s true, I think it\u0026#39;s more about the problem  ","format":"text/plain"},"target":"https://aviary.ecds.emory.edu/collections/1098/collection_resources/32404/file/101167#t=345.22,350.29"},{"id":"https://aviary.ecds.emory.edu/collections/1098/collection_resources/32404/file/101167/transcript/20890/annotation/57","type":"Annotation","motivation":"transcribing","body":{"type":"TextualBody","value":"that we have is how do we distinguish between public and private? And so really, at its very basic  ","format":"text/plain"},"target":"https://aviary.ecds.emory.edu/collections/1098/collection_resources/32404/file/101167#t=350.29,357.67"},{"id":"https://aviary.ecds.emory.edu/collections/1098/collection_resources/32404/file/101167/transcript/20890/annotation/58","type":"Annotation","motivation":"transcribing","body":{"type":"TextualBody","value":"level, public is anything that\u0026#39;s not in the home so you can believe what you want, you can say what you  ","format":"text/plain"},"target":"https://aviary.ecds.emory.edu/collections/1098/collection_resources/32404/file/101167#t=357.67,364.09"},{"id":"https://aviary.ecds.emory.edu/collections/1098/collection_resources/32404/file/101167/transcript/20890/annotation/59","type":"Annotation","motivation":"transcribing","body":{"type":"TextualBody","value":"want in the confines of your home, but anything that is not outside your private space becomes  ","format":"text/plain"},"target":"https://aviary.ecds.emory.edu/collections/1098/collection_resources/32404/file/101167#t=364.09,370.39"},{"id":"https://aviary.ecds.emory.edu/collections/1098/collection_resources/32404/file/101167/transcript/20890/annotation/60","type":"Annotation","motivation":"transcribing","body":{"type":"TextualBody","value":"public and I think there some of the issues are on free speech around freedom of worship etc. have  ","format":"text/plain"},"target":"https://aviary.ecds.emory.edu/collections/1098/collection_resources/32404/file/101167#t=370.39,376.42"},{"id":"https://aviary.ecds.emory.edu/collections/1098/collection_resources/32404/file/101167/transcript/20890/annotation/61","type":"Annotation","motivation":"transcribing","body":{"type":"TextualBody","value":"become contentious because how does the state (a) determine what is legitimate religious practice  ","format":"text/plain"},"target":"https://aviary.ecds.emory.edu/collections/1098/collection_resources/32404/file/101167#t=376.42,382.51"},{"id":"https://aviary.ecds.emory.edu/collections/1098/collection_resources/32404/file/101167/transcript/20890/annotation/62","type":"Annotation","motivation":"transcribing","body":{"type":"TextualBody","value":"when there\u0026#39;s so many competing views about what religious practice is; and (b) how does it balance  ","format":"text/plain"},"target":"https://aviary.ecds.emory.edu/collections/1098/collection_resources/32404/file/101167#t=382.51,387.73"},{"id":"https://aviary.ecds.emory.edu/collections/1098/collection_resources/32404/file/101167/transcript/20890/annotation/63","type":"Annotation","motivation":"transcribing","body":{"type":"TextualBody","value":"that with we want to give everyone equality under the law, when some people\u0026#39;s ideas are what equality  ","format":"text/plain"},"target":"https://aviary.ecds.emory.edu/collections/1098/collection_resources/32404/file/101167#t=387.73,392.44"},{"id":"https://aviary.ecds.emory.edu/collections/1098/collection_resources/32404/file/101167/transcript/20890/annotation/64","type":"Annotation","motivation":"transcribing","body":{"type":"TextualBody","value":"looks like and feels like is very different. The issue around liberalism and tolerating liberalism  ","format":"text/plain"},"target":"https://aviary.ecds.emory.edu/collections/1098/collection_resources/32404/file/101167#t=392.44,399.1"},{"id":"https://aviary.ecds.emory.edu/collections/1098/collection_resources/32404/file/101167/transcript/20890/annotation/65","type":"Annotation","motivation":"transcribing","body":{"type":"TextualBody","value":"is simply that there\u0026#39;s a unspoken value system within liberalism that we normally speak about,  ","format":"text/plain"},"target":"https://aviary.ecds.emory.edu/collections/1098/collection_resources/32404/file/101167#t=399.1,406.15"},{"id":"https://aviary.ecds.emory.edu/collections/1098/collection_resources/32404/file/101167/transcript/20890/annotation/66","type":"Annotation","motivation":"transcribing","body":{"type":"TextualBody","value":"everybody tosses these words around all the time, but that if I walk into a building no one\u0026#39;s gonna  ","format":"text/plain"},"target":"https://aviary.ecds.emory.edu/collections/1098/collection_resources/32404/file/101167#t=406.15,411.79"},{"id":"https://aviary.ecds.emory.edu/collections/1098/collection_resources/32404/file/101167/transcript/20890/annotation/67","type":"Annotation","motivation":"transcribing","body":{"type":"TextualBody","value":"discriminate against me on the basis of my color or my gender or what people may - and they may say  ","format":"text/plain"},"target":"https://aviary.ecds.emory.edu/collections/1098/collection_resources/32404/file/101167#t=411.79,417.61"},{"id":"https://aviary.ecds.emory.edu/collections/1098/collection_resources/32404/file/101167/transcript/20890/annotation/68","type":"Annotation","motivation":"transcribing","body":{"type":"TextualBody","value":"it\u0026#39;s nothing to do with your coloring agenda, but that those are not legitimate reasons for  ","format":"text/plain"},"target":"https://aviary.ecds.emory.edu/collections/1098/collection_resources/32404/file/101167#t=417.61,421.99"},{"id":"https://aviary.ecds.emory.edu/collections/1098/collection_resources/32404/file/101167/transcript/20890/annotation/69","type":"Annotation","motivation":"transcribing","body":{"type":"TextualBody","value":"discrimination. And I think these are huge strides we\u0026#39;ve made in society. What we\u0026#39;re now facing is a  ","format":"text/plain"},"target":"https://aviary.ecds.emory.edu/collections/1098/collection_resources/32404/file/101167#t=421.99,428.86"},{"id":"https://aviary.ecds.emory.edu/collections/1098/collection_resources/32404/file/101167/transcript/20890/annotation/70","type":"Annotation","motivation":"transcribing","body":{"type":"TextualBody","value":"kind of backlash and so for me personally, the backlash against the human rights language is  ","format":"text/plain"},"target":"https://aviary.ecds.emory.edu/collections/1098/collection_resources/32404/file/101167#t=428.86,433.93"},{"id":"https://aviary.ecds.emory.edu/collections/1098/collection_resources/32404/file/101167/transcript/20890/annotation/71","type":"Annotation","motivation":"transcribing","body":{"type":"TextualBody","value":"also really problematic because I often ask people, right, you may think that the human rights language  ","format":"text/plain"},"target":"https://aviary.ecds.emory.edu/collections/1098/collection_resources/32404/file/101167#t=433.93,439.26"},{"id":"https://aviary.ecds.emory.edu/collections/1098/collection_resources/32404/file/101167/transcript/20890/annotation/72","type":"Annotation","motivation":"transcribing","body":{"type":"TextualBody","value":"doesn\u0026#39;t resolve all the issues, but if I ask you which one of your human rights would you be happy  ","format":"text/plain"},"target":"https://aviary.ecds.emory.edu/collections/1098/collection_resources/32404/file/101167#t=439.26,445.47"},{"id":"https://aviary.ecds.emory.edu/collections/1098/collection_resources/32404/file/101167/transcript/20890/annotation/73","type":"Annotation","motivation":"transcribing","body":{"type":"TextualBody","value":"for me to take away, which one would it be? Of course people don\u0026#39;t want any of their rights  ","format":"text/plain"},"target":"https://aviary.ecds.emory.edu/collections/1098/collection_resources/32404/file/101167#t=445.47,449.82"},{"id":"https://aviary.ecds.emory.edu/collections/1098/collection_resources/32404/file/101167/transcript/20890/annotation/74","type":"Annotation","motivation":"transcribing","body":{"type":"TextualBody","value":"taken away. So I\u0026#39;m always trying to think about how you bring the abstract to the lived. And then  ","format":"text/plain"},"target":"https://aviary.ecds.emory.edu/collections/1098/collection_resources/32404/file/101167#t=449.82,456.03"},{"id":"https://aviary.ecds.emory.edu/collections/1098/collection_resources/32404/file/101167/transcript/20890/annotation/75","type":"Annotation","motivation":"transcribing","body":{"type":"TextualBody","value":"when you do that, actually it\u0026#39;s far more complex. And lived is always more complex than the theory.","format":"text/plain"},"target":"https://aviary.ecds.emory.edu/collections/1098/collection_resources/32404/file/101167#t=456.03,465.17"},{"id":"https://aviary.ecds.emory.edu/collections/1098/collection_resources/32404/file/101167/transcript/20890/annotation/76","type":"Annotation","motivation":"transcribing","body":{"type":"TextualBody","value":"I\u0026#39;ve been saying this almost 25 years that Muslims, Muslim communities are part of the West. They\u0026#39;ve  ","format":"text/plain"},"target":"https://aviary.ecds.emory.edu/collections/1098/collection_resources/32404/file/101167#t=465.17,472.04"},{"id":"https://aviary.ecds.emory.edu/collections/1098/collection_resources/32404/file/101167/transcript/20890/annotation/77","type":"Annotation","motivation":"transcribing","body":{"type":"TextualBody","value":"lived in the West, Western culture ideals, freedoms. You know I often say that no country has been  ","format":"text/plain"},"target":"https://aviary.ecds.emory.edu/collections/1098/collection_resources/32404/file/101167#t=472.04,479.45"},{"id":"https://aviary.ecds.emory.edu/collections/1098/collection_resources/32404/file/101167/transcript/20890/annotation/78","type":"Annotation","motivation":"transcribing","body":{"type":"TextualBody","value":"able to sell itself as well as the United States. It sold its movies, its cities, its culture, its food  ","format":"text/plain"},"target":"https://aviary.ecds.emory.edu/collections/1098/collection_resources/32404/file/101167#t=479.45,486.26"},{"id":"https://aviary.ecds.emory.edu/collections/1098/collection_resources/32404/file/101167/transcript/20890/annotation/79","type":"Annotation","motivation":"transcribing","body":{"type":"TextualBody","value":"even - which Europeans always prided themselves on that they were superior -in a way that no  ","format":"text/plain"},"target":"https://aviary.ecds.emory.edu/collections/1098/collection_resources/32404/file/101167#t=486.26,492.68"},{"id":"https://aviary.ecds.emory.edu/collections/1098/collection_resources/32404/file/101167/transcript/20890/annotation/80","type":"Annotation","motivation":"transcribing","body":{"type":"TextualBody","value":"country has. And it sold itself primarily because people wanted that and now of course some people  ","format":"text/plain"},"target":"https://aviary.ecds.emory.edu/collections/1098/collection_resources/32404/file/101167#t=492.68,498.89"},{"id":"https://aviary.ecds.emory.edu/collections/1098/collection_resources/32404/file/101167/transcript/20890/annotation/81","type":"Annotation","motivation":"transcribing","body":{"type":"TextualBody","value":"argue it forced itself, but I don\u0026#39;t think that\u0026#39;s true. So, and I\u0026#39;m saying this because I think that  ","format":"text/plain"},"target":"https://aviary.ecds.emory.edu/collections/1098/collection_resources/32404/file/101167#t=498.89,505.1"},{"id":"https://aviary.ecds.emory.edu/collections/1098/collection_resources/32404/file/101167/transcript/20890/annotation/82","type":"Annotation","motivation":"transcribing","body":{"type":"TextualBody","value":"it\u0026#39;s disingenuous to say that there is an ideal Islam that the West can\u0026#39;t accommodate. The West  ","format":"text/plain"},"target":"https://aviary.ecds.emory.edu/collections/1098/collection_resources/32404/file/101167#t=505.1,511.94"},{"id":"https://aviary.ecds.emory.edu/collections/1098/collection_resources/32404/file/101167/transcript/20890/annotation/83","type":"Annotation","motivation":"transcribing","body":{"type":"TextualBody","value":"is accommodating, the West sees Muslims, the West allows people of different religious communities to  ","format":"text/plain"},"target":"https://aviary.ecds.emory.edu/collections/1098/collection_resources/32404/file/101167#t=511.94,518.84"},{"id":"https://aviary.ecds.emory.edu/collections/1098/collection_resources/32404/file/101167/transcript/20890/annotation/84","type":"Annotation","motivation":"transcribing","body":{"type":"TextualBody","value":"live together. I think the issue is it goes back to when the state has to decide equality rights -","format":"text/plain"},"target":"https://aviary.ecds.emory.edu/collections/1098/collection_resources/32404/file/101167#t=518.84,525.32"},{"id":"https://aviary.ecds.emory.edu/collections/1098/collection_resources/32404/file/101167/transcript/20890/annotation/85","type":"Annotation","motivation":"transcribing","body":{"type":"TextualBody","value":"which I think is its biggest challenge - how do you then accommodate minority viewers within that?","format":"text/plain"},"target":"https://aviary.ecds.emory.edu/collections/1098/collection_resources/32404/file/101167#t=525.32,533.72"},{"id":"https://aviary.ecds.emory.edu/collections/1098/collection_resources/32404/file/101167/transcript/20890/annotation/86","type":"Annotation","motivation":"transcribing","body":{"type":"TextualBody","value":"The problem with the way religious communities assemble is either there\u0026#39;s a question of who is  ","format":"text/plain"},"target":"https://aviary.ecds.emory.edu/collections/1098/collection_resources/32404/file/101167#t=533.72,542.9"},{"id":"https://aviary.ecds.emory.edu/collections/1098/collection_resources/32404/file/101167/transcript/20890/annotation/87","type":"Annotation","motivation":"transcribing","body":{"type":"TextualBody","value":"protected, who can be exempt from certain things? You have that discussion, and then you have well  ","format":"text/plain"},"target":"https://aviary.ecds.emory.edu/collections/1098/collection_resources/32404/file/101167#t=542.9,549.68"},{"id":"https://aviary.ecds.emory.edu/collections/1098/collection_resources/32404/file/101167/transcript/20890/annotation/88","type":"Annotation","motivation":"transcribing","body":{"type":"TextualBody","value":"actually, all religious community - especially the Abrahamic faiths - we can come together against  ","format":"text/plain"},"target":"https://aviary.ecds.emory.edu/collections/1098/collection_resources/32404/file/101167#t=549.68,555.02"},{"id":"https://aviary.ecds.emory.edu/collections/1098/collection_resources/32404/file/101167/transcript/20890/annotation/89","type":"Annotation","motivation":"transcribing","body":{"type":"TextualBody","value":"the state\u0026#39;s imposition of secular norms. So whether it\u0026#39;s gay marriage or whether it\u0026#39;s  ","format":"text/plain"},"target":"https://aviary.ecds.emory.edu/collections/1098/collection_resources/32404/file/101167#t=555.02,560.54"},{"id":"https://aviary.ecds.emory.edu/collections/1098/collection_resources/32404/file/101167/transcript/20890/annotation/90","type":"Annotation","motivation":"transcribing","body":{"type":"TextualBody","value":"even today issues around abortion, there\u0026#39;s a kind of simple gathering of Muslims and  ","format":"text/plain"},"target":"https://aviary.ecds.emory.edu/collections/1098/collection_resources/32404/file/101167#t=560.54,566.69"},{"id":"https://aviary.ecds.emory.edu/collections/1098/collection_resources/32404/file/101167/transcript/20890/annotation/91","type":"Annotation","motivation":"transcribing","body":{"type":"TextualBody","value":"Catholics sometimes, let\u0026#39;s say for example, which I think really does not work because it, it\u0026#39;s, it\u0026#39;s a","format":"text/plain"},"target":"https://aviary.ecds.emory.edu/collections/1098/collection_resources/32404/file/101167#t=566.69,573.65"},{"id":"https://aviary.ecds.emory.edu/collections/1098/collection_resources/32404/file/101167/transcript/20890/annotation/92","type":"Annotation","motivation":"transcribing","body":{"type":"TextualBody","value":"coming together that is very ad hoc, but it\u0026#39;s also always a coming together in defiance of something. ","format":"text/plain"},"target":"https://aviary.ecds.emory.edu/collections/1098/collection_resources/32404/file/101167#t=573.65,580.88"},{"id":"https://aviary.ecds.emory.edu/collections/1098/collection_resources/32404/file/101167/transcript/20890/annotation/93","type":"Annotation","motivation":"transcribing","body":{"type":"TextualBody","value":"I don\u0026#39;t belong to any Muslim communities, it\u0026#39;s \nall my kind of knowledge is really what I hear  ","format":"text/plain"},"target":"https://aviary.ecds.emory.edu/collections/1098/collection_resources/32404/file/101167#t=580.88,586.1"},{"id":"https://aviary.ecds.emory.edu/collections/1098/collection_resources/32404/file/101167/transcript/20890/annotation/94","type":"Annotation","motivation":"transcribing","body":{"type":"TextualBody","value":"and see and some of my discussions, but I think increasingly, at least in the UK now, what you\u0026#39;re  ","format":"text/plain"},"target":"https://aviary.ecds.emory.edu/collections/1098/collection_resources/32404/file/101167#t=586.1,591.89"},{"id":"https://aviary.ecds.emory.edu/collections/1098/collection_resources/32404/file/101167/transcript/20890/annotation/95","type":"Annotation","motivation":"transcribing","body":{"type":"TextualBody","value":"finding is that both in our political rhetoric but now social, that people are arguing that  ","format":"text/plain"},"target":"https://aviary.ecds.emory.edu/collections/1098/collection_resources/32404/file/101167#t=591.89,596.96"},{"id":"https://aviary.ecds.emory.edu/collections/1098/collection_resources/32404/file/101167/transcript/20890/annotation/96","type":"Annotation","motivation":"transcribing","body":{"type":"TextualBody","value":"there is an increasing rise of Islamophobia. I\u0026#39;m not particularly a fan of that word, but  ","format":"text/plain"},"target":"https://aviary.ecds.emory.edu/collections/1098/collection_resources/32404/file/101167#t=596.96,602.06"},{"id":"https://aviary.ecds.emory.edu/collections/1098/collection_resources/32404/file/101167/transcript/20890/annotation/97","type":"Annotation","motivation":"transcribing","body":{"type":"TextualBody","value":"I know why people use it. And that actually it\u0026#39;s not because people can be actively hostile and  ","format":"text/plain"},"target":"https://aviary.ecds.emory.edu/collections/1098/collection_resources/32404/file/101167#t=602.06,608.87"},{"id":"https://aviary.ecds.emory.edu/collections/1098/collection_resources/32404/file/101167/transcript/20890/annotation/98","type":"Annotation","motivation":"transcribing","body":{"type":"TextualBody","value":"say things that are illegal, but people manage to do it through other ways and that slow drip  ","format":"text/plain"},"target":"https://aviary.ecds.emory.edu/collections/1098/collection_resources/32404/file/101167#t=608.87,615.83"},{"id":"https://aviary.ecds.emory.edu/collections/1098/collection_resources/32404/file/101167/transcript/20890/annotation/99","type":"Annotation","motivation":"transcribing","body":{"type":"TextualBody","value":"drip effect of hostility is now creating real division. On the other hand, in the last 10 years  ","format":"text/plain"},"target":"https://aviary.ecds.emory.edu/collections/1098/collection_resources/32404/file/101167#t=615.83,622.01"},{"id":"https://aviary.ecds.emory.edu/collections/1098/collection_resources/32404/file/101167/transcript/20890/annotation/100","type":"Annotation","motivation":"transcribing","body":{"type":"TextualBody","value":"I would say, that you have an increasing gathering together of Christian and Muslim communities and  ","format":"text/plain"},"target":"https://aviary.ecds.emory.edu/collections/1098/collection_resources/32404/file/101167#t=622.01,628.16"},{"id":"https://aviary.ecds.emory.edu/collections/1098/collection_resources/32404/file/101167/transcript/20890/annotation/101","type":"Annotation","motivation":"transcribing","body":{"type":"TextualBody","value":"organizations who want to come together because when Muslims think of the West, they think of  ","format":"text/plain"},"target":"https://aviary.ecds.emory.edu/collections/1098/collection_resources/32404/file/101167#t=628.16,634.91"},{"id":"https://aviary.ecds.emory.edu/collections/1098/collection_resources/32404/file/101167/transcript/20890/annotation/102","type":"Annotation","motivation":"transcribing","body":{"type":"TextualBody","value":"the Christian West, and they will, they will make alliances and friendships with people that they  ","format":"text/plain"},"target":"https://aviary.ecds.emory.edu/collections/1098/collection_resources/32404/file/101167#t=634.91,641.63"},{"id":"https://aviary.ecds.emory.edu/collections/1098/collection_resources/32404/file/101167/transcript/20890/annotation/103","type":"Annotation","motivation":"transcribing","body":{"type":"TextualBody","value":"think will be part of a kind of joint effort to not only tackle hatred of religious communities,","format":"text/plain"},"target":"https://aviary.ecds.emory.edu/collections/1098/collection_resources/32404/file/101167#t=641.63,650.96"},{"id":"https://aviary.ecds.emory.edu/collections/1098/collection_resources/32404/file/101167/transcript/20890/annotation/104","type":"Annotation","motivation":"transcribing","body":{"type":"TextualBody","value":"but also this increasing - I suppose it\u0026#39;s a perception at least  - that society needs to be  ","format":"text/plain"},"target":"https://aviary.ecds.emory.edu/collections/1098/collection_resources/32404/file/101167#t=650.96,658.85"},{"id":"https://aviary.ecds.emory.edu/collections/1098/collection_resources/32404/file/101167/transcript/20890/annotation/105","type":"Annotation","motivation":"transcribing","body":{"type":"TextualBody","value":"flattened out. Where you cannot have, as a French would argue, you cannot have your religious  ","format":"text/plain"},"target":"https://aviary.ecds.emory.edu/collections/1098/collection_resources/32404/file/101167#t=658.85,663.98"},{"id":"https://aviary.ecds.emory.edu/collections/1098/collection_resources/32404/file/101167/transcript/20890/annotation/106","type":"Annotation","motivation":"transcribing","body":{"type":"TextualBody","value":"particularity in public life. And I think with, with Muslims, the bigger problem is not only  ","format":"text/plain"},"target":"https://aviary.ecds.emory.edu/collections/1098/collection_resources/32404/file/101167#t=663.98,670.55"},{"id":"https://aviary.ecds.emory.edu/collections/1098/collection_resources/32404/file/101167/transcript/20890/annotation/107","type":"Annotation","motivation":"transcribing","body":{"type":"TextualBody","value":"one of race, but they\u0026#39;re increasing visibility. I mean it\u0026#39;s a problem in the sense that how we\u0026#39;re  ","format":"text/plain"},"target":"https://aviary.ecds.emory.edu/collections/1098/collection_resources/32404/file/101167#t=670.55,676.46"},{"id":"https://aviary.ecds.emory.edu/collections/1098/collection_resources/32404/file/101167/transcript/20890/annotation/108","type":"Annotation","motivation":"transcribing","body":{"type":"TextualBody","value":"thinking of European societies not that that\u0026#39;s the problem, but they\u0026#39;re increasing visibility  ","format":"text/plain"},"target":"https://aviary.ecds.emory.edu/collections/1098/collection_resources/32404/file/101167#t=676.46,680.3"},{"id":"https://aviary.ecds.emory.edu/collections/1098/collection_resources/32404/file/101167/transcript/20890/annotation/109","type":"Annotation","motivation":"transcribing","body":{"type":"TextualBody","value":"in public life sits awkwardly in Europe and so the visual presence of many Muslims is ","format":"text/plain"},"target":"https://aviary.ecds.emory.edu/collections/1098/collection_resources/32404/file/101167#t=680.3,687.5"},{"id":"https://aviary.ecds.emory.edu/collections/1098/collection_resources/32404/file/101167/transcript/20890/annotation/110","type":"Annotation","motivation":"transcribing","body":{"type":"TextualBody","value":"problematic because they - which values do they fit in with, according to the layperson\u0026#39;s perception?","format":"text/plain"},"target":"https://aviary.ecds.emory.edu/collections/1098/collection_resources/32404/file/101167#t=687.5,697.79"},{"id":"https://aviary.ecds.emory.edu/collections/1098/collection_resources/32404/file/101167/transcript/20890/annotation/111","type":"Annotation","motivation":"transcribing","body":{"type":"TextualBody","value":"There\u0026#39;s a sense that Sharia is seen by what both Muslims use it and non-Muslims. That this is this  ","format":"text/plain"},"target":"https://aviary.ecds.emory.edu/collections/1098/collection_resources/32404/file/101167#t=697.79,704.15"},{"id":"https://aviary.ecds.emory.edu/collections/1098/collection_resources/32404/file/101167/transcript/20890/annotation/112","type":"Annotation","motivation":"transcribing","body":{"type":"TextualBody","value":"codified set of principles and you just go \nto a book and you open it and there\u0026#39;s that, ","format":"text/plain"},"target":"https://aviary.ecds.emory.edu/collections/1098/collection_resources/32404/file/101167#t=704.15,708.29"},{"id":"https://aviary.ecds.emory.edu/collections/1098/collection_resources/32404/file/101167/transcript/20890/annotation/113","type":"Annotation","motivation":"transcribing","body":{"type":"TextualBody","value":"there\u0026#39;s what Sharia says. When actually anyone who knows about jurisprudence in Islam, the whole  ","format":"text/plain"},"target":"https://aviary.ecds.emory.edu/collections/1098/collection_resources/32404/file/101167#t=708.29,714.17"},{"id":"https://aviary.ecds.emory.edu/collections/1098/collection_resources/32404/file/101167/transcript/20890/annotation/114","type":"Annotation","motivation":"transcribing","body":{"type":"TextualBody","value":"legal tradition knows that it\u0026#39;s a juristic, \ndiscursive, contentious, evolving tradition. ","format":"text/plain"},"target":"https://aviary.ecds.emory.edu/collections/1098/collection_resources/32404/file/101167#t=714.17,721.55"},{"id":"https://aviary.ecds.emory.edu/collections/1098/collection_resources/32404/file/101167/transcript/20890/annotation/115","type":"Annotation","motivation":"transcribing","body":{"type":"TextualBody","value":"So, if you were to say, you know, what does Sharia say? The assumption is that there\u0026#39;s only one  ","format":"text/plain"},"target":"https://aviary.ecds.emory.edu/collections/1098/collection_resources/32404/file/101167#t=721.55,726.74"},{"id":"https://aviary.ecds.emory.edu/collections/1098/collection_resources/32404/file/101167/transcript/20890/annotation/116","type":"Annotation","motivation":"transcribing","body":{"type":"TextualBody","value":"answer. There could be multiple answers, but that\u0026#39;s because we think of Sharia as law in  ","format":"text/plain"},"target":"https://aviary.ecds.emory.edu/collections/1098/collection_resources/32404/file/101167#t=726.74,731.87"},{"id":"https://aviary.ecds.emory.edu/collections/1098/collection_resources/32404/file/101167/transcript/20890/annotation/117","type":"Annotation","motivation":"transcribing","body":{"type":"TextualBody","value":"the sense that, you know, what is a law on this? You\u0026#39;d get a straightforward answer for most  ","format":"text/plain"},"target":"https://aviary.ecds.emory.edu/collections/1098/collection_resources/32404/file/101167#t=731.87,735.8"},{"id":"https://aviary.ecds.emory.edu/collections/1098/collection_resources/32404/file/101167/transcript/20890/annotation/118","type":"Annotation","motivation":"transcribing","body":{"type":"TextualBody","value":"things. And I think it\u0026#39;s also problematic \nwhen Muslims say it because they too want to  ","format":"text/plain"},"target":"https://aviary.ecds.emory.edu/collections/1098/collection_resources/32404/file/101167#t=735.8,739.82"},{"id":"https://aviary.ecds.emory.edu/collections/1098/collection_resources/32404/file/101167/transcript/20890/annotation/119","type":"Annotation","motivation":"transcribing","body":{"type":"TextualBody","value":"have that conviction, that when they\u0026#39;ve answered that question they know the right answer.","format":"text/plain"},"target":"https://aviary.ecds.emory.edu/collections/1098/collection_resources/32404/file/101167#t=739.82,745.61"},{"id":"https://aviary.ecds.emory.edu/collections/1098/collection_resources/32404/file/101167/transcript/20890/annotation/120","type":"Annotation","motivation":"transcribing","body":{"type":"TextualBody","value":"This is exactly what Sharia says. But actually the whole tradition is not about a single answer.","format":"text/plain"},"target":"https://aviary.ecds.emory.edu/collections/1098/collection_resources/32404/file/101167#t=745.61,754.92"},{"id":"https://aviary.ecds.emory.edu/collections/1098/collection_resources/32404/file/101167/transcript/20890/annotation/121","type":"Annotation","motivation":"transcribing","body":{"type":"TextualBody","value":"Sharia councils, I think at the moment, they\u0026#39;re a necessity for a certain community of people","format":"text/plain"},"target":"https://aviary.ecds.emory.edu/collections/1098/collection_resources/32404/file/101167#t=754.92,759.75"},{"id":"https://aviary.ecds.emory.edu/collections/1098/collection_resources/32404/file/101167/transcript/20890/annotation/122","type":"Annotation","motivation":"transcribing","body":{"type":"TextualBody","value":"in the sense that they are addressing an issue that the community itself is grappling with, largely  ","format":"text/plain"},"target":"https://aviary.ecds.emory.edu/collections/1098/collection_resources/32404/file/101167#t=759.75,765.3"},{"id":"https://aviary.ecds.emory.edu/collections/1098/collection_resources/32404/file/101167/transcript/20890/annotation/123","type":"Annotation","motivation":"transcribing","body":{"type":"TextualBody","value":"in the area of personal law and divorce. It doesn\u0026#39;t have any legal validity, it has no jurisdiction,  ","format":"text/plain"},"target":"https://aviary.ecds.emory.edu/collections/1098/collection_resources/32404/file/101167#t=765.3,770.97"},{"id":"https://aviary.ecds.emory.edu/collections/1098/collection_resources/32404/file/101167/transcript/20890/annotation/124","type":"Annotation","motivation":"transcribing","body":{"type":"TextualBody","value":"it can\u0026#39;t overrule UK law. So in that sense, it\u0026#39;s not a parallel legal system - nor should it be -","format":"text/plain"},"target":"https://aviary.ecds.emory.edu/collections/1098/collection_resources/32404/file/101167#t=770.97,778.98"},{"id":"https://aviary.ecds.emory.edu/collections/1098/collection_resources/32404/file/101167/transcript/20890/annotation/125","type":"Annotation","motivation":"transcribing","body":{"type":"TextualBody","value":"it\u0026#39;s almost an access to dispute resolution. It sees itself, wrongly, as courts because people  ","format":"text/plain"},"target":"https://aviary.ecds.emory.edu/collections/1098/collection_resources/32404/file/101167#t=778.98,788.97"},{"id":"https://aviary.ecds.emory.edu/collections/1098/collection_resources/32404/file/101167/transcript/20890/annotation/126","type":"Annotation","motivation":"transcribing","body":{"type":"TextualBody","value":"keep labeling them as courts, they\u0026#39;re not. The people working there are not judges, they\u0026#39;re just  ","format":"text/plain"},"target":"https://aviary.ecds.emory.edu/collections/1098/collection_resources/32404/file/101167#t=788.97,793.41"},{"id":"https://aviary.ecds.emory.edu/collections/1098/collection_resources/32404/file/101167/transcript/20890/annotation/127","type":"Annotation","motivation":"transcribing","body":{"type":"TextualBody","value":"people that the community has given a certain deference to, in terms of its religious knowledge.  ","format":"text/plain"},"target":"https://aviary.ecds.emory.edu/collections/1098/collection_resources/32404/file/101167#t=793.41,798.03"},{"id":"https://aviary.ecds.emory.edu/collections/1098/collection_resources/32404/file/101167/transcript/20890/annotation/128","type":"Annotation","motivation":"transcribing","body":{"type":"TextualBody","value":"What that shows is that people from different backgrounds, and different class backgrounds  ","format":"text/plain"},"target":"https://aviary.ecds.emory.edu/collections/1098/collection_resources/32404/file/101167#t=798.03,802.98"},{"id":"https://aviary.ecds.emory.edu/collections/1098/collection_resources/32404/file/101167/transcript/20890/annotation/129","type":"Annotation","motivation":"transcribing","body":{"type":"TextualBody","value":"also, have different expectations of how they want their dispute\u0026#39;s result. \nI certainly don\u0026#39;t  ","format":"text/plain"},"target":"https://aviary.ecds.emory.edu/collections/1098/collection_resources/32404/file/101167#t=802.98,808.71"},{"id":"https://aviary.ecds.emory.edu/collections/1098/collection_resources/32404/file/101167/transcript/20890/annotation/130","type":"Annotation","motivation":"transcribing","body":{"type":"TextualBody","value":"think that you can ban certain things that are a community manifestation. How do you legalize  ","format":"text/plain"},"target":"https://aviary.ecds.emory.edu/collections/1098/collection_resources/32404/file/101167#t=808.71,815.94"},{"id":"https://aviary.ecds.emory.edu/collections/1098/collection_resources/32404/file/101167/transcript/20890/annotation/131","type":"Annotation","motivation":"transcribing","body":{"type":"TextualBody","value":"or un-legalize these things? And for me on the particular issue of marriage and divorce, there  ","format":"text/plain"},"target":"https://aviary.ecds.emory.edu/collections/1098/collection_resources/32404/file/101167#t=815.94,821.7"},{"id":"https://aviary.ecds.emory.edu/collections/1098/collection_resources/32404/file/101167/transcript/20890/annotation/132","type":"Annotation","motivation":"transcribing","body":{"type":"TextualBody","value":"shouldn\u0026#39;t really be a distinction between \nan Islamic marriage and a civil marriage, ","format":"text/plain"},"target":"https://aviary.ecds.emory.edu/collections/1098/collection_resources/32404/file/101167#t=821.7,825.57"},{"id":"https://aviary.ecds.emory.edu/collections/1098/collection_resources/32404/file/101167/transcript/20890/annotation/133","type":"Annotation","motivation":"transcribing","body":{"type":"TextualBody","value":"an Islamic divorce and a civil divorce. \nAnd this has been argued by lots of people, but the religious  ","format":"text/plain"},"target":"https://aviary.ecds.emory.edu/collections/1098/collection_resources/32404/file/101167#t=825.57,831.0"},{"id":"https://aviary.ecds.emory.edu/collections/1098/collection_resources/32404/file/101167/transcript/20890/annotation/134","type":"Annotation","motivation":"transcribing","body":{"type":"TextualBody","value":"aspects and religious frills, let\u0026#39;s say, that make up the marriage and the divorce, are what people  ","format":"text/plain"},"target":"https://aviary.ecds.emory.edu/collections/1098/collection_resources/32404/file/101167#t=831.0,837.03"},{"id":"https://aviary.ecds.emory.edu/collections/1098/collection_resources/32404/file/101167/transcript/20890/annotation/135","type":"Annotation","motivation":"transcribing","body":{"type":"TextualBody","value":"want to hold on to. And this is not to decry or to denigrate or to lessen or reduce people\u0026#39;s  ","format":"text/plain"},"target":"https://aviary.ecds.emory.edu/collections/1098/collection_resources/32404/file/101167#t=837.03,845.16"},{"id":"https://aviary.ecds.emory.edu/collections/1098/collection_resources/32404/file/101167/transcript/20890/annotation/136","type":"Annotation","motivation":"transcribing","body":{"type":"TextualBody","value":"anxieties about faith, it\u0026#39;s to say there are ways forward from this which doesn\u0026#39;t entrench  ","format":"text/plain"},"target":"https://aviary.ecds.emory.edu/collections/1098/collection_resources/32404/file/101167#t=845.16,851.16"},{"id":"https://aviary.ecds.emory.edu/collections/1098/collection_resources/32404/file/101167/transcript/20890/annotation/137","type":"Annotation","motivation":"transcribing","body":{"type":"TextualBody","value":"you in this, well as a Muslim, there\u0026#39;s only so far you can go when you\u0026#39;re living in the West.  ","format":"text/plain"},"target":"https://aviary.ecds.emory.edu/collections/1098/collection_resources/32404/file/101167#t=851.16,856.11"},{"id":"https://aviary.ecds.emory.edu/collections/1098/collection_resources/32404/file/101167/transcript/20890/annotation/138","type":"Annotation","motivation":"transcribing","body":{"type":"TextualBody","value":"And I, this entrenchment of this polarity \nis what I\u0026#39;m kind of always arguing against.","format":"text/plain"},"target":"https://aviary.ecds.emory.edu/collections/1098/collection_resources/32404/file/101167#t=856.11,863.0"}]},{"id":"https://aviary.ecds.emory.edu/collections/1098/collection_resources/32404/file/101167/transcript/20890","type":"AnnotationPage","label":{"en":["English [Transcript]"]},"items":[{"id":"https://aviary.ecds.emory.edu/collections/1098/collection_resources/32404/file/101167/transcript/20890/annotation/139","type":"Annotation","motivation":"subtitling","body":{"type":"TextualBody","value":"https://d9jk7wjtjpu5g.cloudfront.net/file_transcripts/associated_files/000/020/890/original/transcript_1605498347.vtt20201115-1609-1uijhq1?1605480347","format":"text/vtt","language":"en"},"target":"https://d9jk7wjtjpu5g.cloudfront.net/file_transcripts/associated_files/000/020/890/original/transcript_1605498347.vtt20201115-1609-1uijhq1?1605480347"}]}]}]}